Dual wield for tanks - might not be dead after all!

[TheDrunkenDwarf]

I just got done looking at the new screenshots over at Silky Venom and one of them shows a character in plate armor dual wielding!

At the Fanguard I had heard that tanks wouldn't dual wield... but it appears that this has changed since then. (And we cautioned everyone that anything we reported from Fanguard was subject to change as the game is still in development.)

I wonder if there is any noticable DPS difference between dual wielding over using a two hander or if the difference is purely cosmetic and a matter of personal taste.

The tank community seemed pretty split over the subject of dual wielding for heavy fighters, but appeared to accept the "no dual wield" news when it came out.

What are your thoughts now that it appears that it's back?

[Deadjester]

To me it would really depend on how they do their system.

My personal thoughts would be that duel weilders would have the chance to do more sutained DPS damge then a Single or Two Handed weapon but would suffer vs how heavy the armor is if damage reduction is used (which would be logical if they did and would make it very tactical).

But honestly I have no clue how their system is working. All the statments and leaked infomation seem to be just screen shots and stances so far. Very little seems to be about how the combat system itself works.

My hope is that they use armor in two fashions.

1) How heavy the armor is reduces the chances of you actualy getting a hit in.

2a) How heavy the armor is reduces the damage taken when a hit does get in.

2b) How they reduce the damage coming in would be interesting. EQII did a percentage value but that seems skued some how vs weapons that strike more often that do lesser damage and big two handed weapons that stike slower but do more. You could end up with the same damage result. I would like to see some form of permament damage reduction myself dependent on the armor and negates the effects results being skewed

I don't know, just rambling at this point. It may be that armor is just damage reduction and you agilty or what ever is your avoidance, hell they have many ways to do it.

I just hope it works and makes using weapons more tactical in the end result.

Make a reason that has a effect that truely seperates the Duel Weilders, Single handed+shield, and Two Handers on a tactial level.

[Faelor]

Hrm, I think there needs to be a nerf for protective fighters already :P

I would love to see the classes get dual wield, half the time I think of a warrior is someone who has dual blades. *shrug* That may just be me though.

[Kresken]

I'm glad that they are giving at least some of the defensive fighters the option of going dual weild. I think fighters should be allowed to use any weapon..combat is what they do.

But, I also feel that two handers should do a lot more base damage then say two daggers. I just can't see a hulking barbarian running around with toothpicks outdamaging another with a 7 foot greatsword. This is something that other games have let happen and it makes no sense to me at all.

I would really like to see something put in place that differentiates between finesse weapons and brute strength weapons. A warrior in full plate is going for that one hit kill with his claymore. A swashbuckler with his raipier is going to dance around you and take multiple strikes.

[Xexer]

While i admit that it doesnt seem like some guy encumbered by plate armor wouldnt have the finesse to be able to wield two weapons effectively, i do like the option.

There's a lot of weapons made specifically to counter your opponent, whether its disarming or whatever, and the thought of a system that incorporates that idea is appealing to me.

I just hope that it doesnt work like in WoW, where warrior's dual wield is insanely gear dependant.

[Reakk]

While I like the mental picture of a Knight dual wielding (insert name here), and know that it was done quite successfully in ancient times, (the shield was actually invented to stop charges, not one on one combat), I will still always see in my head the classic (insert name of weapon here) and board tank, for the shield protects a much larger area than any weapon, whether it is designed for the function (main-gauche) or not.

That being said, and to apparently contradict myself, I would not mind at all if certain classes could learn weapon breaking techniques or use weapon breaking weapons.

[Gorro]

I think that a tank should be able to use both, I mean, when I think of huge damage taking beings in movies or games, I often visualize them with massive weapons, even if they have two. I don't think these two swords should be able to put out high dps like offensive classes, but rather have lesser dmg output stats and higher defensive/blocking stats. Shields are great, but I don't see any reason why a weapons such as a sword couldn't act like a shield when used properly.

[Fadeyn]

Honestly, I kind of like the option. It would be nice to have 2 weapons while I'm out soloing during some freetime, but I am a definate fan of the sword and board for bigger targets.

[ellestil]

I think the one thing most people will agree on is that having a Sword/Shield combo is usually seen as having greater defense but some lowered offense when compared to either 2 hander combat or dual weilding.

That just leaves whether a 2 hander should outdamage a dual weilder, or vice versa. IMHO, the 2 handers are the epitome of damage in the mindsets of players and in fantasy novels. Duel weilds are seen with finesse, speed, and technique over power.

So, how would I handle it then in game? I would do it like this....

1. Sword/Shield--Highest defense (blocks, parries, ripostes), Lowest offense (dps)

2. Two Hander--Highest offense, Lowest Defense

3. Dual Weild--Med Offense, Med Defense.

In this scenario, a dual weilder will out dps a 1 hander, and also be able to block/parry/riposte/disarm more than a 2 hander. It reflects the style of skill involved in duel weilding more than just DPS numbers. So someone with a 2 hand Axe will do larger dps yes, but will be less able to defend himself compared to a dual weilder. And a sword/shield combo will be more defensive than a dual weilder, but less dps. How's that for a fair bargain?

Ellestil

[Comrowd]

Quite a good idea that, and seems to balance it out, however alot of people see duel weilders as either more/faster dps while two handers are slower for powerful hits, and for varying playstyle and how you wanted to do damage this had some advantages.