Death Mechanic Changes – Feedback Thread

[Astery]

Sigil == SOE, dont you like SWG/EQ2?

No matter how you cry, they need to make an income, and if they believe the income comes from a dumbed down game with simple button smashing (like eq2 is), they gonna implement whatever SOE Devs SUGGEST in those crisis meetings.

Where are the promised features Sigil, why do you spend time on rewriting code that actually made me wanna play VG?

[FEDS-91]

The thing I disliked about the last few dev posts in this, is there isn't even an acknowledgement of the overwhelming dislike for this idea. I think I've seen a total of 5 people say that they're ok with this. The rest is 10 pages of 'NO PLEASE DON'T'. Tells me, that no matter how much we tell them that we don't like it, its going in anyways.

[Elrar]

Originally Posted by FEDS-91

The thing I disliked about the last few dev posts in this, is there isn't even an acknowledgement of the overwhelming dislike for this idea. I think I've seen a total of 5 people say that they're ok with this. The rest is 10 pages of 'NO PLEASE DON'T'. Tells me, that no matter how much we tell them that we don't like it, its going in anyways.

While I can understand this perception it isn't true. We acknowledge both sides, however, as I have stated this is not a completed system and only a single mechanic we are testing. Therefore, subjective opinions are not taken with as much scrutiny as they would be if this was concerning a full system.

We understand there's a desire for risk and a "sting", we understand how many players feel concerning changing mechanics that can effect everyone and the core mechanics of the game itself.

We do not make changes to these mechanics lightly and there is a lot of discussion that takes place internally to iron out the finer points and assess what is best for the playerbase and the long term health of the game.

There are fair arguments from both sides, however, they must be taken with a grain of salt until all of the eggs are in the same basket.

Thanks all

[Myrdinn]

Just say "No" to the alter express.

[Bhagpuss]

Originally Posted by Elrar

We understand there's a desire for risk and a "sting", we understand how many players feel concerning changing mechanics that can effect everyone and the core mechanics of the game itself.

I don't want a "sting". I don't especially want risk. Just get rid of the death penalty altogether, it is far more trouble than it can possibly be worth.

I'm not some Johnny-Come-Lately who never played MMOs before WoW, although if I was I would be a lot more representative of the potential market for Vanguard than I actually am. In fact I started playing MMOs in 1999 and RPGs in 1983.

This cult of "risk vs reward", as exemplified by "death has to hurt" is just twaddle. It has nothing to do with a well-run RPG and everything to do with that cliche DM who could only keep control by threats and bluster.

In a well-run table-top RPG campaign, the DM makes sure that the players don't die unless they are behaving absolutely ridiculously. So long as they are genuine in their attepts to tackle the content, then no matter how incompetent their execution the DM ensures they survive. Often that means fudging the rolls so that characters that should have been vaporised survive.

MMOs don't have the luxury of that kind of personal intervention. Everything is automated and sadly the AI doesn't yet seem to exist to step in and make the giant stumble over his untied bootlace just as he is abut to crush the fallen knight. In the abselnce of that subtlety, let's just recognise that this is a branch of the entertainement media and make sure that the paying customer comes out on top.

I have played through games where one death wiped out a full day's achievement or more. I also used to have a black and white TV set and yellow loon pants. Let's go forwards, not backwards. Stop tinkering with the death penalty and just drop it altogether.

[Isobel]

Originally Posted by Elrar

While I can understand this perception it isn't true. We acknowledge both sides, however, as I have stated this is not a completed system and only a single mechanic we are testing. Therefore, subjective opinions are not taken with as much scrutiny as they would be if this was concerning a full system.

We understand there's a desire for risk and a "sting", we understand how many players feel concerning changing mechanics that can effect everyone and the core mechanics of the game itself.

We do not make changes to these mechanics lightly and there is a lot of discussion that takes place internally to iron out the finer points and assess what is best for the playerbase and the long term health of the game.

There are fair arguments from both sides, however, they must be taken with a grain of salt until all of the eggs are in the same basket.

Thanks all

Nothing we've been told so far gives players any logical reasons behind this propsed chage.

CS problems will not be solved by changing the death mechanic. As was mentioned earlier people will petition the change if they don't understand it.
Communication problems will not be solved by the change. If players can't figure out how to use the current death mechanism how will they figure out the new one? If you believe that the new system can be effectively communicated why can the old system not be effectively communicated as well? It's is not as if changing the whole system will be any easier to explain than the old system.
The problem of death due to bugs will not be solved by changing the system as losing our essence is exactly the same as losing your tombstone.

I think the problem the player you responded to has is the fact that you seem to be telling us repeatedly 'While the reponse to this propsed change seems to be ovewhelmingly negative we're going to do it anway.'

As an aside, it's very difficult to test the new system if we can't log onto the test servers. Could you please help us out or at least acknowledge the problem and give us an ETA?

[Syndic]

I would have to say that this death mechanic seems better than the tombstone idea. Make sure you can still res someones essence.

Death system was one reason I left VG.

[QforQ]

Originally Posted by Isobel

As an aside, it's very difficult to test the new system if we can't log onto the test servers. Could you please help us out or at least acknowledge the problem and give us an ETA?

He already did acknowledge the problem over at Silky Venom and they are working on getting it online. They may not be able to get it online until tomorrow, though.

[Poldera]

silky venom?

[QforQ]

Originally Posted by Poldera

silky venom?

Oops my bad, I read it on their dev tracker haha He posted it here that they are working on it