Dread Knights a Defunct Class?

[Tborg]

I am only 32 so i can't tell about higher abilities. I still think i am a good tank, but i need to work harder to keep aggro from a tank in full dps mode.

What i can understand is crit from Doom and my 400% abilities. My best Doom was at lv 28 for 4151 in TK again a mob pretty much same lv, if i recall it was in tk5. As for my weapon, 2hs 36 dps player made i don't recall the named but its a great maul yellow. I have done 4750 +/- 10 dmg.

Now at lv 32, i my best Doom i have seen was arouns 3000-3200 and my crit 2600 with same hammer. Even again mobs lv 22 3 dot, i started shadowhound quest last nite, i can hit more then 1500-1600 with greatmaul.

I understand that i don't have same debuff then as i group and i didn't have the Bard bonus to dmg ..... But i have been in very similar group with bard between 29-32 and never been able to have similar result.

Is it me or there a problem there? i know some will tell send a record of the fight with all the spell used to debuff. I don't have it parsed and i have no tool for now. I would have thought that i could do better
dmg as i was 3-4 level higher, even vs. lower level mob(10 lv lower), hmmmm i thought wrong!

[Dajag]

Here is some useful feedback. A warrior in my guild is able to deal out close to 20k with his offensive chain. This is a "tank" class. The kind that wears plate.

OMG yeah right dude 20k thats very funny! No picture - never happened.

heres a stat for ya 26 of the top 30 highest melee hits are held by DK's on the leader boards.

and DK's own 70 slots out of the top 100.

[Dajag]

Here some good stuff for ya all to think about -

can DK's solo even con 3 dots ?

can DK's solo even con 2 dots without 20 second down times between everyother mob ?

do DK's lose 70% of their damage output in defensive stance ?

roll a warrior guys if its so great - I'll bet you will be crawling back to your under powered DK's in less then a week.

[Warakus]

Venge... You have done alot for the warrior class... perhaps to much for all of us. I think we ALL need to be nerfed accross the boards in terms of mitigation and avoidance. We have people allready hitting the cap and raid gear isnt even here yet..... thats just stupid. Sigil made the same mistake eq2 did..... EQ never made that mistake... or didnt make it easy to attain!
A raid geared warrior/pally/DK should kick the crap out of a 4 dot! solo yes even the war... his DPS should be so nasty he finishes that thing off before he hits 50%. But right now there is no tweaking to allow us to progress the way we did in EQ (played a raid warrior for years same name) and to be honest I want to see that difference again. I would love to see a warrior kicking the crap out of a 4 dot solo because hes raid geared... or a DK or a pally..... this is how the world works... those who achieve... and those who dont.

What you tank leads really need to be screaming is... "HOW THE HELL DID SOME PEOPLE HIT THE CAP ALLREADY!!! NERF US!!!"


Old wars knew what they were in for here..... thats why we rolled DKs when we saw all tanks would tank the same! Im holding them to it....

Whatever warriors secondary role.. I dont care... as long as it does no infringe on our territory... how they solo or what they can solo is not my concern.... just as long as they dont take the title for only raid tank again.

[Lynxal]

Originally Posted by Warakus

Venge... You have done alot for the warrior class... perhaps to much for all of us. I think we ALL need to be nerfed accross the boards in terms of mitigation and avoidance. We have people allready hitting the cap and raid gear isnt even here yet..... thats just stupid. Sigil made the same mistake eq2 did..... EQ never made that mistake... or didnt make it easy to attain!

EQ made much larger mistakes. Defensive and Complete Heal being the two biggest.

EQ also made the same decisions regarding mitigation caps they were just much lower than Vanguard. Anyone reasonably well geared (100% of raiders and anyone with a static group) contended with the AC soft caps for years. Even when it was "removed" it was still kind of there because you were targetting stat sweet spots to best deal with the average DB and DI of the mobs you were encountering, so you would trade AC for something else more effective. You were always targetting some AC number hard capped, soft capped or effective capped it was still something to choose gear around.

Also, they designed for a long time based on the raid geared player not the common geared player. So massive class nerfs like the monk avoidance changes were implemented to scale down the "ubers" but it screwed the masses for years.

The problem I see in Vanguard is they designed way too heavily for the average player. This game doesn't demand the discipline of EQ for group awareness and agro control which they said it wouldn't but I think they went too far towards WoW and beyond. Mainly because the content is watered down enough and the healing is powerful enough that well geared offensive classes tank nearly as well as defensive fighters for most group trash.

Offensive fighters aren't taking enough damage to outpace a healers heal rate....and all the fights are so short, with huge energy regen rates out of combat that they aren't forced to manage energy really either. In EQ you couldn't generally have a non tank do the tanking because their HPs/Mitigation/Avoidance wouldn't allow them to last long enough for efficient healing.

Because the healers in this game are not expected to only be healing they had to slow down the amount of requried healing. Combined with everything else it makes this game way too easy. Even in WoW a group of 5 people would wipe to 10-15 2-3dot even con mobs (their equivelant). In Vanguard we have to debate in vent whether to run only when the screen fills with mobs....and even then, lagging to hell, the decision is usually "bah lets just see how far we get we might win."

[DrK]

Originally Posted by Dajag

heres a stat for ya 26 of the top 30 highest melee hits are held by DK's on the leader boards.

and DK's own 70 slots out of the top 100.

That's due to a bugged skill that was erroneously reporting the full hit points of whatever mob it was used on as it's damage. said skill no longer exists and was replaced with a completely different skill with the same name. Unless the leader boards are reset it's likely that no one will ever beat those numbers.

[DrK]

Originally Posted by Dajag

Here some good stuff for ya all to think about -

can DK's solo even con 3 dots ?

Depends on the mob. Same with Warriors.

can DK's solo even con 2 dots without 20 second down times between everyother mob ?

No. That's what food is for.

Do DK's lose 70% of their damage output in defensive stance ?

No, but neither do Warriors. And dreadknights in their defensive stance do not get even remotely close to the benefits that warriors get out of theirs.

roll a warrior guys if its so great - I'll bet you will be crawling back to your under powered DK's in less then a week.

I played one up to level 46 in beta, when warriors were significantly weaker than they are now. While I agreed that they needed work (as did everyone) - it's going too far. Hell, my rl friend who plays an equal level warrior to me already feels that warriors have been overpowered and that the idea of warriors getting any type of self healing at all is utterly ridiculous.

Between playing the two classes and seeing the boosts that warriors and paladins have gotten I have the perspective to say that warriors are on the verge of getting too much love and that DK's are currently the least complete out of the defensive fighters and need to be further developed.

[velzevul]

DRK has got a PATHETIC amount of developer attention post-launch. and 80% of that attention were god damn nerfs.

they nerfed a lot of the great things out of our class instead of fixing them, and added very little. issues that we had when we started are still there - weak2useless stances, non-existant/insignificant spell damage, unverified DC effects, lack of class direction. Followed up by nerfs nerfs nerfs.

the only good things we had happen to us, really, that didn't have comparable happen to other def fighters is a spammable counterattack, other than that -

WoD - thanks devs, it is now somewhat usable, nothing to brag about except when PVPing a warrior, it blows them out of the water. but hey, it doesn't matter.
SoD - thanks for bringing it back, you guys almost went back on your promise, good thing Xaices and community forced you to not abandon your own words.
CounterAttack - yeah that matters, thx.
Mana Leeching Chain - yeah that matters 2, thx again, but it still sucks, it doesn't suck enough though, make it suck more mana. where is the promised debuff on that chain?

list goes on and on and on.

[Meldryn]

Originally Posted by Dajag

OMG yeah right dude 20k thats very funny! No picture - never happened.

You do realize that people eventually ding 50 and get decent weapons, right? Come back when you are 50 and have any perspective on this whatsoever.

[Venge]

Again people saying warrior's are getting a self-heal are stretching what I said. I'll be honest. I got a heal ability. Guess what? I had it scrapped within minutes of trying it. Its not happening.

You heard it first .