Racial stat caps and allocation

[Kensu]

Here's the link to the post.

http://forums.vanguardsoh.com/showpo...972&postcount=

and here is the post itself if ya dun want to click it if yer at work or something.

Hopefully I will be able to clear up some of the confusion.

I would like to start off with why we made this change. For a long time we have been trying out the idea that players should be able to max out or hit their “cap” in multiple attributes. We have finally decided this just doesn’t accomplish what we want and dramatically diminishes the potential significance of items. As an item-centric game this was not acceptable to us.

The change to caps means that now someone will only be able to reach the soft cap of 18 under the most extreme conditions. So extreme that it will likely not be possible at release. There is now breathing room for increases in player power (which is important to us).

Attribute growth and racial attributes:

Attribute allocation works basically the same as it always has. However, we do have new racial attribute growth coming in a patch. This accounts for the value of 6 in Jerrith’s post earlier.

All characters start with attributes based on their class. Attribute growth is controlled by race (when the new racial attributes go in the class will no longer be a factor). The attribute pool is still 20 points per level starting at level 10.

For those of you familiar with the attribute growth in Vanguard there is two primary components. Attribute “caps” from race and automatic allocation from race. It is important to understand that the caps from your race don’t have a direct relationship to the old cap of 11 points per level or the new soft cap of 18 points per level. The race caps on attribute reflect how many points can go into the attribute per level.

What does this do? With the cap of 11 it means that you reach your maximum with less gear, earlier. In some ways this is a bonus and in others it is a penalty. With the harder to reach soft cap of 18 these racial bonuses carry more weight. We want them to be a more significant choice.

The second part of the equation is automatic allocation. All characters in the world of Vanguard earn a global pool of 20 point per level as a mentioned earlier. Of this global pool every attribute always gains 1 point when you level. This leaves 14 points for customization. In concert with the racial caps points are usually automatically allocated to fill in the cap bonus for the race. For example, in the old racial bonuses a Halfing had a dexterity cap bonus of 2 points per level. They also had 2 points per level automatically allocated to dexterity. This allows races to grown in their own special ways while still giving players room to customize most of their attribute growth.

For the new attribute cap bonuses we are intending:


STR CON DEX VIT WIS INT
BarbarianQalia 2 1 0 0 1 0
BarbarianThestra 2 1 0 0 1 0
Dwarf 0 3 0 0 1 0
ElfDark 0 0 1 0 1 2
ElfHigh 0 0 0 0 3 1
ElfWood 0 0 2 2 0 0
Gnome 0 1 0 1 0 2
Goblin 0 0 1 0 0 3
HalfElf 0 0 2 1 1 0
HalfGiant 3 1 0 0 0 0
Halfling 0 0 3 0 1 0
HumanKojan 1 1 1 1 1 1
HumanMordebi 1 1 1 1 1 1
HumanQalia 1 1 1 1 1 1
HumanThestra 1 1 1 1 1 1
Kurashasa 0 1 0 0 1 2
Orc 2 0 0 2 0 0
Raki 0 0 2 2 0 0
Vulmane 0 1 1 0 2 0

The attribute cap in pointer per level can be found by adding 5 to the value in the above table.

The new automatic allocation and customization points we are intending:

STR CON DEX VIT WIS INT Points to Spend
BarbarianQalia 2 1 0 0 1 0 10
BarbarianThestra 2 1 0 0 1 0 10
Dwarf 0 3 0 0 1 0 10
ElfDark 0 0 1 0 1 2 10
ElfHigh 0 0 0 0 3 1 10
ElfWood 0 0 2 2 0 0 10
Gnome 0 1 0 1 0 2 10
Goblin 0 0 1 0 0 3 10
HalfElf 0 0 2 1 1 0 10
HalfGiant 3 1 0 0 0 0 10
Halfling 0 0 3 0 1 0 10
HumanKojan 0 0 0 0 0 0 14
HumanMordebi 0 0 0 0 0 0 14
HumanQalia 0 0 0 0 0 0 14
HumanThestra 0 0 0 0 0 0 14
Kurashasa 0 1 0 0 1 2 10
Orc 2 0 0 2 0 0 10
Raki 0 0 2 2 0 0 10
Vulmane 0 1 1 0 2 0 10

You may spend points in an attribute until you have reached your racial cap.

Buffs:

The next portion of player attributes comes from buffs. The portion coming from buffs has not been altered. They will continue to be a very significant reward that is basically free and in many cases a bonus to be in a group with others.

Items:

Items now have the potential to do more. Players have more flexibility with the items they want to use. We thought that allowing items to relatively quickly bring players to their caps would make them want to diversify (“max” more than one attribute). This worked well for some people. However for others it was forced. Many people would get a new item that buffed their favorite attribute and it wouldn’t feel much of an effect because they had already hit their intended max on that particular attribute.

Players now have the option of taking a more extreme route and focuses on one or two attributes. However, the cost in other areas of trying to “max out” a single attribute is high. We feel that the rewards granted for every class across multiple attributes will mean the best players will have some diversification. Ultimately, this more open ended approach will give us each more control as we play.

Several people have voiced some concern regarding changes in the current state of their character. Many people had their character maxed out in multiple ways at level 40. Fortunately, you are no longer maxed out. However, the bonuses you get from high attribute points to things like damage have not remained exactly the same.

Along with increasing the intended cap for attributes we have made a soft cap the standard if one does reach it. We have also increased the amount of contribution attributes can have across the board. Of course, this makes sense since there is a lot more ground that can be covered. The attribute bonus increase factors are based on the previous contribution of the attribute and the desired contribute of the attribute. In most cases this will not leave you with the exact same bonus that you had prior to the changes.

Not everything has been rescaled yet but will be in the next few days as we prepare for release. For example, the maximum size for energy pools has not changed. So in this area people will likely feel like they have significantly less energy than previously. All of the combat attribute contributions were adjusted with the cap changes patch.

Please remember we are doing a lot of intense balance work now as well. Adjusting things like damage, mitigation and evasion is a big part of that. We will be continuing these types of changes we wrap up the pre-release class and archetype balancing and get our solo and group combat experience nailed down.

Thanks everyone for all of your dedication as beta testers. By pushing the limits of Vanguard you have been a huge factor in making the game as great as it has become. These dramatic improvements are just one example of that process. Please continue pushing us as beta comes to a close and we get ready to go live.
__________________
David Forrest
Senior Programmer
Sigil Games Online, Inc




Enjoy =)

Edit: new stat info as of the 19th

The races in Vanguard have new attribute bonuses!

Starting at level 10 characters start to gain racial attributes. The following table illustrates the attribute bonus attribute points that a character will receive. All characters receive one point in every attribute each level in addition to the bonus points.

RACE STR CON DEX VIT WIS INT
Varanjar 1 2 0 0 1 0
Varanthari 2 1 0 0 1 0
Dwarf 0 3 0 0 1 0
Dark Elf 0 0 1 0 1 2
High Elf 0 0 0 0 3 1
Wood Elf 0 0 2 2 0 0
Gnome 0 1 0 0 0 3
Goblin 0 0 0 3 0 1
Half Elf 0 0 2 1 1 0
Lesser Giant 3 1 0 0 0 0
Halfling 0 0 3 0 1 0
Kojani 0 0 0 0 0 0
Mordebi 0 0 0 0 0 0
Qaliathari 0 0 0 0 0 0
Thestran 0 0 0 0 0 0
Kurashasa 0 2 0 0 0 2
Orc 2 2 0 0 0 0
Raki 0 0 1 2 0 1
Vulmane 1 0 1 0 2 0


In addition to the bonus points each race with the exception of the four human races (Kokani, Mordebi, Qaliathari and Thestran) earns 10 attribute customization points per level. The non-human races may spend up to 4 attribute points in each attribute per level. They do not all have to be spent at the same time. At level 11 a character could have spent 8 points total in any one attribute. The human races gain 14 attribute customization points per level and may spend 5 points in a single attribute per level.

There is no longer attribute gain associated with your class.

[Eclipse]

My head is seriously spinning.
It is taking all of my attention to focus on what they're talking about...I have no idea why I understood absolutely everything before, and now can't get a grip on it.

Could someone put in POINT FORM what exactly has changed, and what it means to us?

Thanks, all my appreciation!

~Cevantez Kaervek, Dreadknight and Scion of The Seraphim
-Eclipse

[velzevul]

cliffs: they are tweaking racial choices to balance them with racial abilities. I think the idea developers are trying to achieve -

a) some races historically are stronger at something than other races
b) on average, if race A is good in class A, there will also be a number of other classes that this race will not be so good at. because of historical events or something.

thats how I understand this idea

[XeroKill]

Just to clean up the patch notes there for easier viewing, here it is in code format. Also here is a link to a stat calculator made up by Saty in the Training Grounds. Thread: Stat Calculator

The races in Vanguard have new attribute bonuses!

Starting at level 10 characters start to gain racial attributes. The following table illustrates the attribute bonus attribute points that a character will receive. All characters receive one point in every attribute each level in addition to the bonus points.

Race          STR CON DEX VIT WIS INT
Varanjar       1   2   0   0   1   0
Varanthari     2   1   0   0   1   0
Dwarf          0   3   0   0   1   0
Dark Elf       0   0   1   0   1   2
High Elf       0   0   0   0   3   1
Wood Elf       0   0   2   2   0   0
Gnome          0   1   0   0   0   3
Goblin         0   0   0   3   0   1
Half Elf       0   0   2   1   1   0
Lesser Giant   3   1   0   0   0   0
Halfling       0   0   3   0   1   0
Kojani*        0   0   0   0   0   0
Mordebi*       0   0   0   0   0   0
Qaliathari*    0   0   0   0   0   0
Thestran*      0   0   0   0   0   0
Kurashasa      0   2   0   0   0   2
Orc            2   2   0   0   0   0
Raki           0   0   1   2   0   1
Vulmane        1   0   1   0   2   0

In addition to the bonus points each race with the exception of the four human races (Kokani, Mordebi, Qaliathari and Thestran) earns 10 attribute customization points per level. The non-human races may spend up to 4 attribute points in each attribute per level. They do not all have to be spent at the same time. At level 11 a character could have spent 8 points total in any one attribute.

*The human races gain 14 attribute customization points per level and may spend 5 points in a single attribute per level.

There is no longer attribute gain associated with your class.

[XeroKill]

I took the liberty of doing some research about how the stats will work based on the new information. You can check out the results at the following thread.

Dread Knight Stats and You!

[Kensu]

lol this thread has officially been hijacked ><